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Morale - How are we doing?
Wednesday, 28 October 2009
Some recent news articles have questioned the morale of our Soldiers and Families and their abillity to sustain themselves through an era of persistent conflict.
The CAB and Sustainment brigades have/are returning from long deployments... 1BCT was off-ramped from their OIF mission yet people are worried they will go to Afghanistan instead... 2BCT just departed for Iraq... I just visited with 3BCT Soldiers and while their OEF mission has been tough I think they are holding up very well.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on the morale of the 10th Mountain Community.
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If you are a hard worker, you are only given more work and responsibility to pick up for the lazy...and then not rewarded because "they are just doing their job". There is NO INCENTIVE to stay motivated because after a deployment, you're still going to be running 100mph waiting to go back over again. I personally can't wait for my ADSO to be up so that I can get back to having a normal life (ie. have a home I live in with my wife) again.
These are all different situations happening to me and my husband right now. My husband and I together decided to join the Army because we lived in an economically depressed area. He was an E7 in the Air Force and he worked hard for his rank. When he came to the Army they lowerd him 2 ranks, and for what switching his uniform? People who get DUI's only get bumped down 1 rank for an article 15.
My husband makes 3% less than the rest of the civilian population, but Fort Drum has attempted to push military families out into the local community. Many of us have difficulties paying for National Grid's prices, or fuel oil, and don't get me started on grocery bills. If you have a large family like we do, you just can't find cheap places to rent. Many people live as far out as the 1000 island district just to find a decent house. That means many soldiers drive far to work, from 15 minutes which is not a horrible commute, up to 45 minutes. That means the inflated gas prices are comming down hard on our soldiers and their families just to commute. Sure there are government programs you can get on, but if you have to deal with them you know it is a full time job just to stay on the benefits like HEAP, WIC, Foodstamps, etc. Applying for MWR programs is not easy for families who live off base and only have one vehicle.
While at work our soldiers are not being given minimal respect. Expecting your commanding officers to know how to manage time, correctly assess mission/OPs tempo, and give you clear, defined, and legal orders is appropriate. If a commanding officer cannot do that he is not giving the proper respect to his troops or their families.
Time management is one of the reasons morale is so low. I want to make my position on the matter very clear to the command. Our guys here at Fort Drum are in garrison. There is absolutely no excuse, no reason, no situation that cannot be dealt with in a timely manner that the men and women cannot be released at 4pm daily. If your supporting command structure is inefficient with time management to the point that they are not releasing men who have up to 45 minute drives to go home and see their families, till 5 or 6 PM on a regluar basis then you need to come down hard on them for inefficiency. Because that is just a waste of money on a logistics level, and is causing an extreme drop in Morale.
I don't mind the two week deployments here or there for training. Deployments have never really bothered me as they are a way of life in the military. Sure I miss my husband when he is gone, but until recently that was never a problem. He had this wonderful thing called job fulfillment and was very happy and excited when he came home after receiving beneficial training. Now every deployment, even JRTC, is riddled with inefficieny and confusion are the part of the command structure.
What this all boils down to is a certain attitude in the Army that I have observed; That all must suffer, simply for the sake of suffering, because that is the macho thing to do. That attitude is unrealistic. Expecting people to suffer through trivial matters which have no bearing of importance exhausts their patience and endurance for when they must suffer for the sake of the lives of their brothers and sisters on the battle field. If the men are deployed with morale this low, I am afraid for them and their success.
First, thank you for the opportunity to express what is on our minds in a truly non-attributional setting. I deployed to OIF with the Div HQ and may or may not go back out again as I am awaiting PCS orders. My morale is fine because I enjoy being a Soldier and this is one of four divisions I served in.
The issue here is the division staff OPTEMPO and why the heck are we killing ourselves when we are not going to deploy until the spring of '11? We preach 'balance' and 'family time' and 'standard duty day.' It's all rhetoric! Anyone in the rank of MAJ or above who believes officers and NCOs on your staff are not working late evenings and on the weekend are delusional.
Since returning back from OIF in May, the pace we are keeping is similar to being deployed down range. Immediately upon our return, we thought we would have to deploy to OIF in a year, but when the decision was made for us to deploy in '11, the staff OPTEMPO has not slowed down. Like a BCT and Bde, the Division Staff is feeling the effects of going through the ARFORGEN process. We are losing people faster than we are gaining people, yet we are still going out to train the division staff TAC and Main CPs beginning next month with division staff members who will not deploy and most of your 'go to war' staff will be in place next summer. Further, we have Div CPXs we are now mandated to execute on top of all of the day-to-day support we provide our subordinate divisional units. Honestly, at this pace, I would rather be deployed.
We have all sounded off that we are short personnel in our division staff QTBs. Every staff section has said the same thing - we are losing people, we don't have enough people and the people I have are not going to deploy with the division. We get the head nod, the requirements still keep on coming, but not the personnel. We waste more time 'staffing' products that do not need staffing. How many more times are we going to discuss PT routes or speed limits on post. While deployed, we have SGTs and LTs making strategic level decisions while on patrol but we have no trust in a MSG, SGM, CW2, MAJ or LTC to make rudimentary decisions? Sir, once we get something to you, you make decisions and give sound guidance. The non-sense we put up with getting it to you is unbelievable.
Like IRON MAJ said in his earlier post, your staff is going to run out of gas before it gets to the race! You have very talented and dedicated Soldiers, officers, and MSE civilians on your staff whose talents are being wasted, and they are getting tired by the pace they are keeping. I am all for increasing the OPTEMPO and pace six months prior to our deployment but why now? It makes no sense.
Sir, I recently read your bio on-line and saw that you commanded 2-22 IN in the '90s. I think it's about time the HQ lives up to the motto - "Deeds, Not Words!"
Thanks.
I would think you can even agree that whatever you beleive in or feel we can do more at home for ALL soldiers during dwell time, and I think that is what this blog is all about.
Now onto what the general asked. Sir without sounding disrespectful if you have to ask how our morale is then I think you dont know whats going on. And sure when you personally go check on soldiers the whole dog and pony show is rolled out for you just like it is when any general officer comes around. If you really want to know how things are show at SRC or DFAC in PT's or a uniform without rank and start jaw jacking with soldiers, you will then find out how they feel. You could always do a survey, but they cant be like ones in the past where the questions are written to benefit what the army wants to see.
But there is no way to fix this until our country gives a little more of a break then we have now. But there are ways to make it better. Without going into a big long ramble, the biggest thing is MORE TIME AT HOME. Whether that means shorter work days, more 3 and 4 day weekends, some half days, etc. I blame BN and BDE leadership too, because they are big boys and there are times where the BN CO could come out and tell everybody to come home at 3pm.
Whatever happens it needs to be mandatory. There was a general at my old post at hood, he said we had to be home by 1600, and guess what he got into his chopper and made sure this is true. Why i say this because there are commanders out there at the company level and BN level that try to be heroes and keep people around still. Hope something happens, but like others have said, nothing is going to happen as always.
However, I don't think you're actually reading this blog. You have soldiers and family members on here who's morale is low because they are tired. They never see each other and, unlike you, they don't know why any more.
You say that you "still understand what needs to get done over here." You're one of the few then because no one else seems to know why we're there. You also say that "We are getting deployed so often and for so long for a reason. Our country needs us to be."
Really. The United States of America needs for our men and women to be in Afghanistan and Iraq playing security guard, building houses, and dying for people who lie to their faces about where the enemy is? I'm pretty sure the USA needs our men and women HERE. They aren't protecting us by being over there, they are protecting people who don't even want them there. And what happens when another attack happens on US soil? Oh, whoops, all of our soldiers were in another country.
Think about this.... How would your moral be if we lost this war?
When we win, we can relax.
Im an 11b in Afghanistan for the 2nd time. In this deployment alone, I have lost 10 friends, 5 of them who were pretty damn close to me. It sucks, but I still understand what needs to get done over here, and I get it done. I understand why we have to fight, because we can not lose.
The biggest thing that Im trying to figure out is how do soldiers enlist during a time of war and have the thought that everything is going to be easy? That somehow enslisting is going to keep them from getting deployed. If you didnt want to get deployed you shouldnt have signed up in the first place.
These are some of the same guys who claim PTSD without ever deploying or go and shoot themselves because their NCO yelled at them.
God Forbid NCO yell at soldiers, what a horrible crisis that would be.
People are complaining and whining because moral is low. Maybe if they would stop and think about what they are signing up to do, instead of what they are signing up to get, there would be no reason for their moral to get low.
We are getting deployed so often and for so long for a reason. Our country needs us to be. Sorry its to tough for some people to handle, but for the most part these are the people complaining about the fact there is no American Cheese in the DFAC, or that the gym doesnt have enough weight in it, or that the PX is out of DIP. Its kind of pathetic.
So this is my suggestion...
If you dont like it, then stop complaining and get out. Cause its not going to change anytime soon. Once your back do the rest of us who understand and deal with what happens over here a favor, but only, of course after you get ample family time with your wife and kids, spread the word to all of your SOFT HEARTED friends who are thinking about enlisting because they think the job is easy. Consider it your way of helping the economy by saving the government money instead of it on training another batch of SOFT HEARTED "soldiers".
If you take offense to this, sorry it hit so close to home.
But this whole blog is BS. If your moral is low it is because you are Weak Minded and Soft Hearted.
Never Forget Why We Are Here.
(Moderator Comment: This comment was edited in accordance with the Blog Comment Policy)
First off some of the morale issue, might be with the post, but I say this is a great place and soldiers need to find other things to do other than hitting clubs or the mall. The FACT of the matter is most of us are sick and tired of deployments and to be honest for WHAT?? Honestly 8 of 10 soldiers/officers i talk to are somewhat disgruntled to highly disgruntled. We are gone so much that whats the point of having a family, a house, a boat, etc etc. Then when we are back for 12 months we spend one month at Polk, and then you add the time of field problems, staff duty/CQ, other events we are probably at home in bed at nights with our wives for maybe 9-10 months then were gone again. You have no control over when we leave but things could be better when we are home. There is no need to work till 5-6-7pm at night daily, there is nothing to do. Now one opinion I have is, I dont see why we cant have 1600 work days, half day fridays, etc. Im all about training and getting things done, but there is plenty of time for us to be at home on an earlier basis. For this to be effective it has to be mandatory because there are still Commanders that will keep SFC's officers etc at work, while soldiers only can go home, which is not fair. Overall there is plenty of oppurtunity to give soldiers time to be at home, not having them sitting in their Company area or sitting a desk waiting for an email to pop up on outlook.
You were quoted as saying: “Given that we’re an army at war in a persistent conflict, what we can control is dwell time (the time soldiers are home). “We’ve got to make sure (while soldiers are home) we’re doing everything smart. If soldiers and their families have the perception that the pace (of deployments and training at home) is impacting on morale, I’m going to address that.”
Its not a "perception". It's a fact. And you're going to address this? Okay. How? I'm smart enough to know my husband won't even be home a full 12 months when he gets back, let alone this out right LIE of 2 years... but you are right, how dwell time is spent could potentially make a difference, but even when they're home, they're never really home. Why do you need to send our soldiers off for "training" weeks at a time to other states? Why are they spending countless nights in the field? I get it, sometimes it is necessary. But what the hell are they doing all DAY while they're at work? It's their job to train, so why aren't they training from sun-up to sun-down and then allowed to go home?
Sure, your sensing pessimism here because it's wonderful that you SAY you'll be doing something about this. SAY what you want, but your actions are all that matter.
PS. Oh yeah, and after your recent visit to Afghanistan, you were also quoted as saying, “I think they’re holding up very well,” OF COURSE THEY ARE! They're trained to "hold up well". Do you really think a soldier is going to tell you the truth that they think this mission is futile and that they struggle to see the point of being there? No, you're not going to get that. But wise up sir, you know that what you hear is not always the truth.
In relation to the question, most folks have addressed it in terms of OPTEMPO - over the course of eight years.
I hear and recognize the concern. What I can do is look at ways to help maximize the dwell time we do have. There are a variety of options we can look at ranging from establishing a set duty week, to adjusting PT schedules - all intended to help you spend a little more of that time where you need to - with friends and families...
I've been a platoon sergeant and when I was, I made my squad leaders release their people before they could go. Once they were gone, then I could leave. I'd love to see something similar done at a higher level. If the division commander couldn't leave until all the brigade commanders left, and the brigade commanders couldn't go until the battalion commanders and all the way down the line, the result would be a focus on letting soldiers go home, when there's no training to do. Lets make time with families more important than just being at the office. We live in the information age. If something happens after you go home, there is always a way to get that information.
To the spouse that said its a lack of knowledge or laziness that is low morale for the families I disagree, sure the kids can take any sport I can find, I can work a full time job, and I can have every hobby I can cram into the day but none of it makes up for the fact that your spouse is gone, and gone a lot. Getting out of the cycle for many is not an option, to some the positions are just not open and to others it is career suicide.
As for soldiers low morale, they have the same problem, after 3, 4 or 5 deployments you are just tired. I heard it said best a few years ago, one deployment you are proud, two your pride slips a little but by 4 or 5 you are just tired. It's also hard that the army seems to bear the brunt of deployments now in the past everyone deployed for about 6 months, but now your standing next to working side by side airmen that are deployed for 4-6 months while you are gone for 12-15. It begs the question of why are we all not gone for 9-10 to even it out?
For most soldiers I think the major issue is that after 8 years it just seems like there is no end in sight. Rather then seeing dwell time increase and deployments decrease as we have been hearing the past years deployment time increases and dwell time decreases.
I know that other then bringing these issues up to your superiors that is not much that you can do to help dwell time but you can help us with the dwell time we do have here. More service schools local would be nice. Too many soldiers have to take long TDY's to get in schooling that is needed, please include all ranks including Officers and Warrant Officers in this. Also limiting field problems and duty days. Soldiers on a year dwell really need a valid reason to have to work weekends beyond the colonel is having a tantrum. Also an increase in the number of 4 day weekends offered.
What we don't need as soldiers and families alike is more programs to fill the time, we just need more time.
Most of these people are blowing smoke, this place sucks. There is no other post like this in the Army, it is it's own Army. There is no communication at all on post with events or anything like that. My good friend SFC Monti received the CMH and there was a memorial at DIV, nothing was put out any where about it until the after fact. This Post is the reason why I am getting out after 10years, and a lot of other Soldiers are also. There is just no time to rest once you return from a deployment and yes there is a difference when you go to another post.
(Moderator Comment: The Medal of Honor ceremony for SFC Monti was held in Washington, DC. There was no memorial ceremony held at division headquarters.)
The most recent article about moral being low does not speak for me or many of my Soldiers. I have been with the 3IBCT since it was activated in 2004 and this is my second deployment with the 3IBCT. During our time in Afghanistan I have seen the Soldiers work tirelessly to positively change the battlefield here. They have been asked to the impossible and they made it happen. We have taken the fight to the enemy here in Afghanistan and gone places that other units will not go. We have fought up North along the border and in the Korengal valley and down South in the Heldman province and worked hard to help the people and government of Afghanistan. Now we are stabilizing areas that other have not been in Logar and Wardak.
The 10th Mountain Division has been the most successful division in this war on terror. Whether it is in Iraq or Afghanistan we are always in the fight making a change. I am very proud to be a part of the best division in the United States Army especially the 3rd Brigade Combat “Spartans”. The Soldiers here do not want to see another attack on U.S. soil again and will do everything in their power to prevent it from happening again. We are here to protect the people back home and we are proud to do so.
Deployment is very hard for families especially after we enter our 8th year of War. However we are Soldiers and we all knew what we were doing when we raised our right hand and swore to protect the constitution. Generations before us made much greater sacrifices then what we are making now. I will fight until the war is won.
Climb to Glory
Oh, and to the CAB Soldier who thinks it is "rumors" that CAB is going in 2010 ... Department of Defense made that announcement in September 2009 and the CAB made that announcement in theater. Oh, and MG Oates announced it to the Spouses in June 2009. I think that is pretty "official".
How about those who have a hard time adjusting ... if you need to talk to someone, call ACS 772-6557 and ask to talk to an MFLC; if you are bored volunteer with the FRG, ACS, AFTB, your church, the Red Cross, a school, ANYWHERE; go back to school, the Ed Center is inside the library; JCC and BOCES offers personal enrichment classes
Soldiers ... if you want out of the cycle check for TRADOC positions ... recruiting, drill sergeant, instructor, kick those guys who stick around WLC for years (seriously, why do they get to stick around the WLC for 2, 3, 4 years??? SSG next door works 10 days a month!!!) out and do a year or two there.
Thank you for putting this issue out there, as morale is definitely a problem right now. My husband is on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan in 6 years. He is a true Soldier and doesn't complain about it, as he knows it is his duty, but I can tell he's tired. The families are tired of the strain as well. Now, there is even more responsibility being put on the 3BCT families with the upcoming reunions. We were told that we were responsible for finding out when the reunion ceremonies would be ourselves, either by going on the vFRG or calling a staff duty number. No one is going to call out (isn't that what our key callers are for) to give us information. So, if you don't have internet access or can't get to the phone, you will NOT KNOW when your Soldier is returning. With all the things we have to do, why add another responsibility to the families?? The previous deployments were not like this, calls came out through the FRG (I made the calls myself, as I was a key caller), why has it changed?
OPTEMPO is crappy no matter where you go. Dwell time will be encroached because of training needs - there's no way around that either. It's how you feel and your quality of life that you actually have during those off times that really determines your overall happiness - not the misery we ALL feel when we're deployed away from our families. (Campbell, Benning, Knox, Hood, Bragg, Drum, it doesn't matter - when your spouse is deployed it just sucks period no matter where you are.)
I would have to say in fairness though that this post has the best, newest facilities than any other in the Army. The housing is excellent - WAY above the rest of the Army standard in my opinion. And the people and community here are extremely supportive of the soliders and families.
Ok, so you don't like hunting and fishing? How about riding bikes, walking, history, cross-country skiing or just plain hanging out? This area is more conducive to healthy family life than anywhere else I've been (and I'm not a hunter or fisherman either by the way) because it's a clean slate and you can pretty much do whatever you want to. If you're a city person, well, sorry. There's not one close by but NYC is within striking distance and Fort Hamilton is a great place to stay while you visit... Again, it is what you make of it.
My family has suffered through some hard times with deployments, etc., and I'd have to admit this lifestyle contributed to my marriage going south. But that's the ARMY, not Fort Drum.
Anyone can always find a justifyable reason to not like it here and that's perfectly fine. As for me, I'm just as tired as the next guy, but I like it here when I'm here and I'm thankful for that.
OBTW - glsd to see you're keeping up with the blog. It's a great equalizer...
I feel like he just got home and indeed it was a year ago tomorrow that he returned from his last deployment. We were at Fort Drum for only a few months after he came home. My husband had been their for the majority of his military career at that point and I guess we were tired of long winters and multiple deployments. He felt that he needed a break from the unit he had already deployed with twice in three years! We were PCS'd to Fort Campbell and let me tell you... it makes Fort Drum look like a cake walk. If you want an installation that acts on those words of "caring about the family", stick it out at Drum.
Folks at Drum are much more accomodating, the support at Drum is there if you seek it, where here, they will tell you what they think you want to hear to get you out of their office and move along. Here at Campbell Officers and Enlisted do not mingle, it is unheard of, just like the OLD ARMY! Soldiers who stick it out at Drum are clearly the good ol' boys who care about raising their families in a clean and healthy environment.
At Fort Drum civilians have a chance at getting a GS position. While I know the deployments are running all of us down... Army wide.... know that you are in a place that cares, with great people, surrounded by an area with low crime and with outstanding education for our younger children.
Both my husband and I are the first to admit, we did not know what we had until it was gone.... and we are not alone, as so many of those we have met here that have come from Drum feel the exact same way!!!!
Best wishes to all of you... espceisally 3BCT... you have had a long and difficult deployment. I pray for each of you every day!!!
I believe that yes it is hard to see the one that you love leave but there is alot of support out there. May it be from FRG, Friends and family. Fort Drum offers alot of family oriented programs.There's also Behavioral Health.You learn who your true friends are when you need someone just to help or just to listen. I have an awesome friend, whom I met here at drum, who if I need support she's there for me, guess she's more like family than anything else, and when she needs the same I am there for her. Yes it's not the same as a husband or wife. I married my husband knowing what he does and since I accepted what he did then I knew that with him came the deployments and the late nights of working. I can't complain about the path he has chosen. He is going career and I support his discison. I'm not going to lie and say that deployments aren't hard for me and the kids and when he comes home it isn't hard for us to adjust to being independant but we comprimise and get back into the routine we we're in before he left. I love my husband and will always support the disicions that he/we make as a family. Our FRG is there and keeps us updated and when a problem arises they will try to help or help find the resources to point you in the right directions. My/our moral is good and I thank my friends and FRG for support when I need it the most.
This December will mark my thirteenth with the 10th Mountain Division, and not by choice. During this time with the division, I have been witness to may changes, some good, some bad. Living conditions continue to improve at Fort Drum, however, Soldiers and family members have little or no time to make use of these available resourses, especially the lower enlisted.
The current OPTEMPO of the divison has put increased stress on the Soldiers and families with no end in sight. Units already know when they are going to JRTC as well as returning to Afghanistan. As many others have said above, when Soldiers are at home, they really aren't. The SEC DEF and the Chief of Staff of the Army talk a good game of DWELL time and taking care of families, but the bottom line is that it is all just for show in the media.
Every new commander does not care about the long term affects of their actions in the here and now. All they are concerned with is what they can do to pad their OER or NCOER during the short time that they are in command, usually 18-24 months, becasue they want to get promoted. During these short command periods, commanders and Sergeants Majors encounter problems involving everything from leadership, Soldier, and family problems that for them, the command team, is nothing more than an inconvience. Instead of figuring out a long term solutions to these sometimes complex issues, these leaders simply slap a bandaid on them and leave them for the next command team to deal with. This has become the norm here with 3RD BCT.
These command teams, BN Level, do not care about dwell time or family members becasue they know that after the deployment they will be moving to another location or position in which they will not have to deal with it or even deploy for an extended period of time. Soldiers, junior Soldiers do not have this option.
It is more difficult than you can possibly imagine to be forced to stand in fornt of leaders that preach the Army Values to Soldiers and tell them they must live these values then to watch these same leaders committ acts that contradict everything that these very same values and everything they stand for. To these leaders, the Armyt Values are nothing more than words on a poster on a wall.
Morale is at a all time low, but you will never see it becasue your subordinate leaders don't have the courage to tell you the truth. The Army now condons down playing issues in order to safe face and get a good rating on OERs and NCOERS. Integrity and honesty are the values that elude most leaders in the Army today.
I know that deployments will continue, no change in that anytime soon but it would sure be nice to have them home and settled sometimes. Staying positive is the hardest thing and just as soon as they get home from a deployment it is the countdown to another one. Sad but true this is the life of a Soldier and His Family.
We Survive and we will continue to Survive. An army family is a family that can get through ANYTHING we do it everyday and for that STRENGTH I am greatful.
First off I think it is great that you have decided to open up the forum on this Low Morale issue that has been spread world wide after the article written by the chaplain of my unit. I will say that Morale is low to an extent for some some reasons that are pretty typical of a deployment. We are about ten months into the deployment and we all miss our family, are grieving for our fallen soldiers, and yes are ready to get back home. I also believe that some of the soldiers and leaders get pretty frustrated at times with the current ROE per say. When you are at the front line you can never have a clear picture of why ISAF is wanting this and enforcing that. So I do believe that many of our morale issues are common with multiple deployments and probably no different than any other unit. I did see a morale drop as the news came out of our possible redeployment date. It is very hard to swallow that pill when soldiers hear on the news of politicians and big wigs talking about 18 to 24 month dwell time and the rumor going around that this BCT will not be getting that. It is tough times right now when you break it down to the cycle. If a unit is deployed for 12 months at a time the dwell time back is pretty short if you think about it and that is really sinking into a lot of soldiers I think. If you are looking at a 12 to 14 month dwell time before the next deployment it does down right sucks. If you look at the time spent away from the family for the field time, OPT's, NCOES, and other military schools, the time spent with the family and friends is really short. I really believe that the morale took a turn for the worst when the rumor came out about the next possible deployment date. I truly believe that the soldiers were really counting on the the 18 to 24 months that was hitting all the news for awhile. I have heard soldiers talking about the reenlistment process and are doing so because they have nothing else to fall back on and that isn't a good thing because soldiers use to reenlist because they loved what they did and enjoyed it. I can say that I have seen many of soldiers reenlist to stay in the army for many reasons and soldiers that are talking about reenlisting as well. To the surprise, quite a few soldiers are reenlisting to stay at Fort Drum. Now I do believe their reasonings for staying at Fort Drum is for the better of two evils. Meaning that staying at Fort Drum, they are possibly getting the most of their dwell time whatever that time frame will be. I know when I went to talk to my REUP NCO I was really thinking of getting out but was not for sure. I have been in for quite some time now and have had multiple deployments and it has taken a toll on my family. With the state of the economy and needing to provide for my family I decided it was best for me and my family to stay in the army and my REUP NCO showed me that as well. I just don't believe the majority is doing it for the love of the game. I know that some of my fellow soldiers have received the ultimatum from their wives to choose either the Army or me. So to conclude this I believe that the Troop Morale would not be so bad if the time between deployments was not so short. Many of my soldiers and leaders have stated that it would not be so bad if they had more time to sleep in their own beds.
Deeds Not Words
First and Foremost, thank you for taking the time to field a question such as this, knowing the responses are going to be about how Fort Drum is all but perfect.
My spouse and I are both Soldiers of this Division, and I would like to take this opportunity to answer this question truthfully, from a dual-Military point of view. We are currently enrolled in the MACP, which has done absolutely nothing to benefit us. I have took the issue to my chain of command, and while some were willing to give us assistance, as it moved higher up the chain, it was tossed out. My most Senior of Leadership has condoned my spouse and myself from moving into the same unit, or at least get on a more regular deployment schedule. Out of the last 2 years, and looking out to the next 3, (if totaled up on past, present and future deployments, we will have spent about 8-10 months together. Out of 5 years. I hope you will see how this is not going to affect our relationship positively. We will miss out on raising our family together, additions to our family will be put off for years, and many other things that couples look forward to most, will be put on hold. It is very, very discouraging to look at things from this perspective, when we have the Army telling us there is nothing they can do to prevent this, when I see unit swaps, deployment schedules and other changes being made for individuals/couples on a very regular basis, but then am told nothing can be done.
We are tired, worn out, and would love nothing more than to come home at night and share dinner together, talk about our day, or just simply get to look at one another face to face. Currently, that is just simply a far-fetched desire, as my spouse is deployed, so I wait by the phone, hoping that I am not going to miss a call because of my own work schedule.
My spouses' unit theatre conditions are sub-standard, making their morale poor to nil at times. It is so hard to hear those sorts of things when I know my spouse loves thier MOS, and what they do. It has definately taken a toll on our decisions whether or not to remain dual-Military.
I have decided once my contract is up, that I am going to support my spouse from a different perspective, and give up the life of being dual-Military. I have loved being a Soldier, and under different circumstances, would consider re-enlisting, but I do not see the Army, or my Leadership willing to re-work assignments in order for us to do so.
Other individuals have great points on here as well: dwell time here on Fort Drum, isn't always "time at home" (JRTC, NTC, BNCOC, etc), and there is an abundance of unit cohesion problems.
In closing Sir, I would like to thank you again for your time, Climb To Glory.
I appreciate that you as a CG are taking the time to ask for our thoughts. As the spouse of a Company Commander and an FRG Leader, I get input from both our soldiers' families and the view from where a Commander sits. While recent articles have sighted morale as low and many soldiers in Afghanistan have fought back with harsh words for their wavering peers, I can honestly say that from my view, we are lucky the deployment for 3BCT is ending. Our soldiers are tired, distressed and fighting with, what seems like, one hand tied behind their backs. My husband, as a leader, worries every day that his men have lost faith in him as a trustworthy and intelligent Commander. It is hard to maintain high morale in their unit when those in "middle management" struggle with hiding their own sense of despair.
It's not so say that Big Army doesn't care about the welfare and morale of their soldiers and families, I believe this is not the case. At home, there are many programs and outlets for us to utilize, not just as civilians but for our soldiers as well. Many concerns come from within the unit downrange. Our men are soldiers through and through. They are not the first to raise their hands and ask for help or complain that they can't get the job done. Unfortunately, Battalion, Brigade and Division Command need to recognize that not all goals can been met or exceeded in just 12 short months. Our soldiers are working tirelessly to complete their missions but they often feel that they are sent into dangerous situations to satisfy the whim of a success hungry Commander. While our COP is miles and miles from the FOB, our soldiers have made it as livable as possible and support each other to keep the Company morale as high as they can. They work as a family to keep hot meals on the table, laundry services running, heat in the quarters and functioning MWR services. They recognize that anything they can do for each other to forget the stress of missions, can help get them through this dangerous deployment. I only worry that they don't see that the Company Commander feels the same way they do.
As this deployment ends, we are fortunate enough to be PCS'ing to a new location and will likely have more than the 12+/- month reset time. I think it is hard for many families to understand the grand design that the Army has laid out when it comes to reset and training. I believe the reason for this is that there is very little time to reconnect as a family and help our soliders to let go of the pain and stress of war...before they have to do it all over again. Knowing what I know as a spouse and Leader, I can say that many of our soldiers are struggling and morale continues to fall as this deployment ends. The care and rejuvenation of these men and women need to be our first concern now and upon their return.
This deployment he left exactly two months after the birth of our first child. It's already been extremely hard on both of us-- I have to care for our daughter, the house, and everything else on my own, all while missing him and wishing he were here; and he is upset that, for almost the entire first year of his daughter's life, he will be absent and miss out on all her "firsts", all while also missing us and wishing he were here.
I was aware of what our life together would be like when we got married, but I never imagined that more than half our time would be spent apart.
Of all the army wives and soldiers I know, and speaking for myself as well, I can honestly say that morale is VERY low right now. There seems to be an almost constant turn around when it comes to the deployments: 12 months here, 12 months deployed. The time spent "home" is almost never HOME. There's all the training, all the schools, all the field exercises... and when they're not doing any of that, and they have regular duty days, they get off later than they are originally supposed to because they spend most of the time doing nothing, and then suddenly have to get things done at the last minute, which makes them get off late.
Two days before my husband and his platoon left, they had their accountability formation. It was a day off for them, but they went in in the morning for the formation and were released afterwards. The next day they had to go into work and were there until 12:00-1:00. They did NOTHING. My husband said they just sat around the whole time, wondering to each other why they were actually there when they could have been home spending time with their families, since it was THE DAY BEFORE THEY WERE GOING TO LEAVE. Why did they not let them have their scheduled day off without having to go in, and then have the accountability formation the next day, the day before they left? Why have them go in and do nothing, and just sit around? Why take that time away from the families? I could see if there was something that needed to be done to have them come in... But when there is absolutely no reason to keep them there, why not just release them??? My husband, me, and all the other soldiers and wives were all extremely upset by this! And I fully believe we had every reason in the world to be upset!
Situations like that do NOTHING to help morale. All they do is make it worse.
I do not sit here and presume to know what needs to be done to help morale for our soldiers and their families. Obviously deployments and training are going to happen... there's no doubt about that. But something DOES need to be done! There's supposedly this Army-wide move to being more about the families... I do not see that at all.
We're all tired-- mentally, physically, and especially emotionally-- of the strain that's being put on us EVERY SINGLE YEAR from one thing or another.
Thank you for asking this, and for being willing to listen to what we have to say!
My husband just returned from his second deployment while here at Fort Drum (his fourth overall). You ask about morale and I can tell you honestly, I have none left. I am tired. I am tired of spending every other year by myself. I'm tired of the mindset that kicks in after every deployment and a new Commander comes in thinking the Soldiers have to get training because there's a deployment coming up. Consequently the Soldier has no downtime to reset even though he's just gotten home.
I am tired of the stress that's caused by incompetent people being in command and not understanding that issues that affect Soldiers affect families too and the stress this can cause on an already stressed-out situation (this last deployment was particularly horrible).
How much morale can a Soldier have when he's been on the promotion list for over a year but hasn't been picked up because the points don't drop low enough? He'd love to reclass but he's in a "closed MOS" (whatever that means).
I am especially tired of living in the black hole that is Watertown and the North Country – Fort Drum may be a sportsman’s paradise but most spouses I know aren’t into hunting. Sure, we can drive to Syracuse (an hour each way) but that’s not an option in the winter months unless you want to risk your life. Fort Drum offers everything it possibly can, but once you go outside the gates, it's an entirely different world.
This is a hard thing to ask us as we prepare for yet another deployment. As for the community, I think the morale is at a all time low. I served in OIF I during the invasion and did 13 months then. I also did 15 months just 11 months ago. I think the biggest morale crusher is the fact that we cannot leave this place. G1 does and outstanding job of keeping us "fenced in". When we do our time, we are told that we are fenced in for yet another deployment. I guess it wouldn't be so bad if we were able to enjoy the other side of the Army, besides just the combat arms side.
I do appreciate your concern with this matter. My family has stood by myside and will continue to do so. I do know it is wearing on them. I know I am not the only one, but I am ready to continue to serve where needed.
"CLIMB TO GLORY"
Let me first say I appreciate you asking this question. This is a tough issue and you probably deserve a BSM for all the shots you're taking with the responses. Most of them have to do with OPTEMPO and there's nothing you can do about that - we all have to pitch in and do our duty when called.
I was happy to come to 10th MTN and grew up in the division as a CPT; now a MAJ and one of a handful of staff officers still remaining from our last OIF deployment. What I find most interesting - and frankly a little disappointing - is how we seem to have skipped over that dwell time thing...
We used to joke in Iraq about attacks being down and still working the same hours as 3ID did when they were getting 10 attacks a day. Now that we're back we joke about sitting through marathon staff planning sessions for a deployment 18 months away - that the majority of us won't be here for! Or we're spending time in numerous boards, cells, working groups, OPTs, etc., to tackle the tough issues of new PT maps or whether or not the traffic lights should flash or hold a steady cycle in the morning...
Personally, my morale is fine. I'm PCSing shortly (and I will honestly miss it here) but the guys who came in over the summer (all happy to hear we weren't going out the door again till 2011) are all scratching their heads wondering what the heck we are doing and why are we burning the midnight oil now on things that just aren't that important? If I had a nickel for every time I've heard someone joke about "this is what you guys consider dwell time?"...
I know we're all type A personalities, but isn't it okay to occasionally coast on the downhill runs?
I asked my husband what he thought about the recent report in the news concerning the chaplain's comments and he agreed with them, every word.
This is my husband's second deployment, with the first being close to 17 months since his unit was extended. The morale this time around has been on a rapid decline. It was bad at first with no heat, food or showers and no milk or fruit for months. It had improved slightly since then, but now it is sliding back down even further. There have been soldiers who say 'it's not my job' when asked to do certain duties. Since when can you say that?? My husband's day to day duties have absolutely NOTHING to do with his MOS or training.
Promotions have very little to do with merit it seems, only if your MOS has the openings can you get a promotion. People who barely contribute get their ranks before others simply because of their MOS. My husband has been 'promotable' since Feb. and still has not received his rank because the points are maxed out for him to get his E-6. This is a shame.
The Army just piles on the responsibilities on the soldier's they know will do what is asked of them, while letting others just skate by and do the bare minimum. Why aren't we getting everyone to carry their own weight? If you abuse the good soldiers, you lose their reenlistments.
My husband was excited to join 6 years ago, but he will not be reenlisting (he originally signed for 6 years) due to the poor management, accountability issues and promotion of undeserving and unqualified individuals. He has a college degree and left a very lucrative job because he felt he had a calling to help in the Army, only to be leaving the Army now with a broken spirit and totally disillusioned with the system. (Maybe this is just my husband's unit, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it is not isolated.)
The deployments for the Army are too long and too close together to foster any kind of stable home life, especially for children. Families are always on edge, waiting for the next training cycle, school or deployment that takes away their soldier.
Thank you for asking, and we appreciate you taking the time to consider our responses.
One of the area that need to be address is the FRG, or the Family Support Group. Which I think is all about show and no real action when the CG or CSM is around, it all sound good on paper, and seems to disappear once the plane leaves, and the support leaves and those young family that have no real military working knowledge to find for themselves,and it is hard for them and it lead to problems and Morale issues for the Soldiers down range. My wife was deployed for almost a year, I was taking care of three kids, the youngest 2 year old girl, and not once did I get a called from the FRG of any kind inviting us to any function, (IE) Christmas party, Easter egg hunt, no report of how the unit was doing down range, but I guest if you ask the leaders of the FRG, they would say we contact all the family members and all was well. The community is not a well oil machine as it can be. I think that more need to be done from the top, so that when the Soldiers return they would have less to worry about and a smooth transition with the spouse.
Five deployments, ANCOC, BNCOC, JRTC, NTC, pathfinders, MLARM (sp?), field problems, MOS specific schools....the list is neverending. Even when "home", they're not allowed to be home. At the last minute, I was told that a training meeting trumped a long-awaited pediatric specialty appointment for his child.
After enduring this for years, I've learned that this isn't just about the absence, it's about the culture of the NCO that prevents any real dependable support for families if career progression is desired. Soldiers are discouraged implicitly and explicitly from missing work for any scheduled or non-scheduled family needs.
Your problem is two-fold. Deployment and training OP tempo takes soldiers physically away from their families. NCO culture takes them away even when physically present.
Unless someone is equipped for and content with single parenthood or a long distance relationship with sporadic contributions from the AD spouse, or the soldier bucks the culture and puts family first, marriages will fail over and over again.
Its very hard to stay up beat and encourage morale when you dont really have suffienct time to simply enjoy each other, all your family time post deployment seems tainted by the constant shadow of immediate pre-deployment trainings and processes that will mandatorily reserve up a large portion of the soldiers time. If something isn't done to recover a soldiers "dwell time" My husband and I truly feel the morale may hit an all time low and cause problems for many military families and units.
I think is it very sad that 3rd Brigade soldiers out in the COPs have been there this entire deployment without showers and heaters. My husband it has been getting down into the 20's at night and yet they do not have heaters in their tents. That is down right dangerous. These men and women are out their doing their jobs to the best of their ability in rediculous conditions. I have to ask...Would you be willing to live for 10 months without showers and go through the winter with no heater? I have to say I think the answer to that would be no. So why do we ask our soldiers to work in these conditions and then wonder why their moral is low? Is it asking too much for them to be given basic living neccessities? If the chain of command discovered a soldier here at drum was living somewhere with no heat in the winter they would do everything within their power to get that soldier heat. Aside from geographical location what is the difference?
I am comming off my third deployment within the last 5 years, second with the 10th CAB. Morale a year ago was pretty good but I think it is on the decline due to the fact of "rumors" of a deployment to Afganastan in less than a year after we got back not to mention reset and the gunneries, NTC's, and JRTC rotations that will have to be conducted in order to get ready to go back to combat. That is alot to ask of young soldier's and families. I have not heard anything official so I try to quell these rumor's when I hear them. I have some of the finest soldiers in the Division serving with me and for me and this is a concern with many soldiers and their families as with me. I am proud to serve and do my time in combat but also would like to be assured I will get to see my wife and young children more than a year at a time as would many soldiers. Right now I feel the over all morale in the brigade is pretty good but could quickly go south if there is any truth to a deployment in less than a year. So yes I agree op-tempo is a factor in morale.
Thanks for your concern
I am not sure that I can speak for the whole of Bravo Company 1-87 IN but, I can see that the morale goes up and down. Up because of the fact that we did get off-ramped as you say but at the same time, I don't think that we want to sit around think about what could happen. Leaving a Soldier to just sit around and talk, or even think about what might be going on is the worst thing ever. Minds can wonder sir, and that right thehre is the things that get Soldier in trouble. Plus the other thing is the Families to think about, we were all prepared in our minds to go and then that go canceled which takes alot of stress off, but again it is the "what if" Factor to consider in everything. Now families are even more worried about the fact that Afghanistan is worse then when I was over there in 2003. So in closing I am sure that morale os higher due to the fact that we have been off-ramped, but now we just sit and think, which in turn can lower morale just the same. Some food for thought.
Thank you for your concern.
Renee
I think the higher chain of command, including the Garrison Commander could do well with "playing private" for a day. Instead of asking how a soldier's family feels, spend a day with one. Spend a day at Guthrie Clinic, waiting in the waiting room like everyone else, and waiting in the pharmamcy like everyone else. Spend a day with a privates family balancing budgets and buying grocery, and running erronds. I realize rank has more than earned it's privilideges, but I think more often than not, you forgot what the bottom feels like.
I more than understand that you all are very busy, but take a day, and really talk to families, not just in passing.
I think, sadly, it would be an eye opener for you.
Sincerely,
A Privates Wife, Proud Army Wife, & Proud Government Employee
I have a son serving his 2nd term in Iraq. I told him that the soldiers coming home in 2010 are supposed to have 2 years before getting deployed. He said that will never happen. He ha a 2-1/2 year old and saw him for 9 months of his life. Daddy is the computer his son things. His wife has to raise him alone and work. Try juggling that. The parents try to make sure the wife and Grandson keep busy or need support. Many soldier have agreed 6 months would be the best for everyone and that the airforce and Navy that is all they get deployed for. My son loves his job, but keeping him away from his family really hurts. President Obama please end the war or help these soldiers from losing there families.
Soldiers and families are getting tired. Most in the Division are on their second or third tour, some more. Dwell time is not really dwell time with JRTC or NTC, OPT and other requirments. There is nothing really to look forward to. I think moral is on the decline for both soldiers and families because of what I stated above.